“Senior Officials Believed Pence Would Support Use Of 25th Amendment”

“The much-anticipated book ‘A Warning,’ reportedly written by an unnamed senior White House official, claims that high-level White House aides were certain that Vice President Mike Pence would support the use of the 25th Amendment to have President Donald Trump removed from office because of mental incapacity.”

(NOTE: The author of this book is the same person who gained notoriety for an anonymous NYT op-ed some time ago.)

“According to Anonymous, there was no doubt in the minds of these senior officials that Pence would support invoking the 25th Amendment if the majority of the Cabinet signed off on it.”

This is basically gossip at this point. The author does not specify which aides believed that, or how many, or why. It is possible that this was just two people stating their gut feel, and did not involve any overt indication from Pence. Whether the officials believed it or not, I see no evidence that Pence did anything to create this belief.

22 thoughts on ““Senior Officials Believed Pence Would Support Use Of 25th Amendment”

    1. Thanks for the correction. But, Alan Dulles was still alive and he was fired as head of the CIA by JFK. Alan Dulles still had connections at the CIA and the CIA had worked with the Mafia (at least in regards to trying to assassinate or embarrass Fidel Castro, possibly in overthrowing governments in Central/South America) while Alan Dulles was head of the CIA.

  1. Good work Scoop. Comprehensive putdown of the usual recycled crap emanating from Fox/Infowars World and reminding me why I’m not totally down with the President Biden concept at the same time. Deux d’un coup. And one thing to toss in – the Bonk is apparently unfamiliar with the concept of “rainmaker” as it relates to Hunter Biden.
    Talking about the alternate universe now. I always enjoy the irony of the Very Devil Himself , George Soros, having made the pithiest statement of American realpolitik interests in regard to Ukraine – that without Ukraine there can be no Imperialist Russia. The last time I went looking for the exact quote I had to wade through 4 screens of shit with headlines about how the evil Jew had helped the CIA overthrow the wonderful regime in Kiyiv. It’s pretty skanky out there in Bizarro World.

    1. Skanky indeed.

      I have been a naive fool for decades. I never knew that America was so full of bigotry and just plain stupidity. Officials like Trump and websites like 4Chan have really awakened me.

      And frankly I wish I were still asleep, dreaming my dreams about the resonant words of Lincoln and Emma Lazarus and Walt Whitman and JFK, and maintaining my fantasies about how America, despite its rough youth, having been born in genocide and reared in slavery, finally emerged as the world’s good guy.

      I see how guys like Ike, MacArthur, Marshall and Truman (and the Brits) won the war, then rebuilt the torn world with their bare hands, firmly but compassionately, and I wonder, “Have we really been doing straight downhill since the late 40s, or have I just matured enough to recognize reality?”

      1. There has always human scum. That is why we have laws and punishment for violating them, and police. In a nation of 300,000,000 plus, even if something is so vile that only 1 person in 10,000 is involved in it, that is still a large absolute number of people (30,000, less children and those too disabled to act on it). And with the Internet, a lot of them can talk to each other now, which is the new (and bad) thing. In the 40’s, these people could be swept under the rugs, just like civil rights for blacks.

        But we don’t judge humanity by either the best or the worst of us, IMO. We judge by the average (you can use what kind of average you like). To me, the average American is all right. Not everything one could wish, but decent. If the average as not all right, we would be living in Somalia, circa “Black Hawk Down”.

        The vile are very discouraging though, especialy when they obtain power or popularity. That is why Trump, and Lindsay Graham, and Moscow Mitch get me down. So did the people who relentlessly persecuted the Clintons, like Ken Starr. Don’t get me started.

      2. The thing is, if you are a college educated person of good will and generally associate yourself with educated people of good will, it’s easy to think that’s just the way the people are now. When I was a kid in the 1970’s, I’d hear adults talking about the n*****s and the Sp**ks. But by mid to late 90’s, I stopped hearing people use that language. I think a large part of it was that it just wasn’t as socially acceptable to speak that way. But perhaps an even larger part of it was I just wasn’t hanging out with people that used that language. I was in law school then. It was easy to think racism just wasn’t the force it used to be. Clearly it wasn’t, we elected a black president only a decade later. But it was a stronger force than I thought it was.

        But today, I think we have to be careful not to make the same mistake in the opposite direction. 4 Chan is a cesspool. It and other social media sites allow people with some really heinous beliefs to communicate with each other and organize. That organization makes them dangerous. But it also acts like a megaphone making it appear that that there are more people holding those views then there really are. I agree with everything Mr. Cornelison says here. Well, not quite everything, but I liked the symmetry. But I do agree with everything he said right up to and including Trump. We can agree to disagree about the people he mentions after Trump. The larger point is that most Americans, hell most human beings, are good and decent even if they make mistakes from time to time.

      3. I don’t think the United States has gone straight downhill. General MacArthur was a power hungry extremist (one reason Eisenhower ran for President was to prevent MacArthur from running for President.)

        Unfortunately Eisenhower appointed the psychopathic Dulles Brothers, Allen and John Foster, to positions of very high power, one as Director of the CIA and the other as Secretary of State. The Dulles Brothers were the first ‘neo conservatives’ equivalent to Richard Perle and Dick Cheney if not John Bolton.

        One of the more plausible conspiracy theories on the murder of JFK is that the Dulles Brothers had him killed (in league with the Mafia) for his firing Allen Dulles as head of the CIA. Whether there is any truth to this conspiracy theory or not, I don’t know, but if you read about the Dulles brothers, it certainly isn’t outside their characters to do that.

        The other thing about the Dulles Brothers is that, even though they were both almost certainly psychopaths, they acted with sophistication and charm, or as people in the major media outlets would be concerned about these days, they acted with ‘civility.’ So, they were regarded as decent people although they both have major blood on their hands.

        So, no, people in positions of power in the United States government being outright evil is not something new.

        1. MacArthur was a very flawed man in many, many ways, and an egomaniac. I don’t care for him at all.

          But his stewardship (or, if you prefer, dictatorship) of post-war Japan was remarkable. It was a massive project, and he organized it with utmost discipline and firmness, but also with compassion and respect, and its effects were lasting. He may not have made a great leader for the USA, but he was arguably the greatest leader modern Japan ever had. (Oh, hell, that’s not even arguable. He’s it.)

  2. Good luck with the impeachment. It appears as though the Biden tape hasn’t made it into Dem circles yet. I don’t think I can post links here, and I doubt if othercrap readers are interested in the truth, but here’s what Sleepy Joe said to an audience in January 2018:

    “And so I got to Ukraine. And I remember going over, I guess the 12th/13th time to Kiev. And I was supposed to announce there was another billion dollar loan guarantee. And I had gotten a commitment from Poroshenko and Yatsenyuk that they would take action against the state prosecutor. And they didn’t. So they said they had – they were walking out to a press conference. I said nah, I’m not going to – or we’re not going to give you the billion dollars. They said, you have no authority. You’re not the president, the president said. I said call him. (Laughter) I said I’m telling you, you’re not getting the billion dollars. I’m going to be leaving here in, I think it was six hours. I looked at them and said, I’m leaving in six hours. If the prosecutor is not fired, you’re not getting the money. Well, son of a bitch. (Laughter) He got fired.

    Put Trump and Trump Jr. in the same situation – bragging about withholding money from Ukraine, while Jr. collected upwards of $1m per year from a company…and having the prosecutor fired who was investigating him.

    You can’t make this stuff up. We are trying to frame Trump for Biden’s crimes. Hilarious. Unfortunately for Dems, the facts will eventually be reported by the MSM.

    1. This has all been public knowledge for months, and we have gone over it many times. Biden not only said all that at that time, but has bragged about it many times, and with good reason. He perfectly executed the mission he was given.

      (1) he was not representing himself, but the position of the United States

      (2) and the United States was speaking in unison with the European Community, the World Bank, several major corporations, and several major lending institutions, all of whom agreed – no investment in Ukraine until Shokin was removed.

      Shokin was a holdover from the administration of the former president who was run out of town by the Maidan Revolution. He, like his former boss, was notoriously corrupt, and failed to indict anyone from the former administration which had been bilking billions from the country’s coffers.

      Many reform-minded top Ukrainian officials resigned simply because Shokin had not been dismissed, including Shokin’s own top deputy. In early 2016, when Deputy General Prosecutor Vitaliy Kasko resigned in protest of corruption within Shokin’s office, he declared: “Today, the General Prosecutor’s office is a brake on the reform of criminal justice, a hotbed of corruption, an instrument of political pressure, one of the key obstacles to the arrival of foreign investment in Ukraine.”

      (3) Biden’s yarn implies that the guy was removed immediately, before Biden’s plane left the ground. (He didn’t actually say that, but the wording of the story leads you to believe it.) That embellishment is one of his typical Bidenisms. It was quite a bit later when the resignation was demanded and accepted by the Ukrainian Parliament.

      (4) And, most telling, the guy was removed for NOT pursuing investigations, including that one. If Biden had been seeking to protect Burisma, he would have insisted that the guy be retained! Biden actually acted against Burisma’s interests. (Burisma was the company that placed Hunter on the board.) The subsequent prosecutor did re-open the investigation, but dropped it when nothing substantial materialized.

      (5) But even if all that were not true, there was no connection between Hunter Biden and the Burisma investigation in the first place. The specific questionable action on Burisma’s part was the sale of a fuel storage depot which may or may not have been part of a money laundering scheme. That happened many months before Hunter was hired. The principal owner of Burisma decided to clean up the company, or at least to make it appear squeaky clean after that incident, so he hired an all-new board to give the firm a special veneer of propriety. His three star hires were the former president of Poland, a Frenchman known as the Warren Buffett of France, and the son of the American vice-president. Was he taking advantage of their names without actually using much of their services? Sure. They were getting money for doing nothing. But there was nothing illegal or unethical about it.

      Key point to repeat: at no time was Burisma being investigated for any activities that occurred while Hunter Biden was on the board!!!

      And, to repeat my previous point, because it is critical. The prosecutor, Shokin, was dismissed by Parliament for NOT pursuing investigations. If Joe Biden had wanted to help Burisma, he would have insisted that the guy stay in place!! Of course he never had that option, because his boss, all the Western democracies, and all the major investors weren’t going to touch Ukraine until Shokin was gone.

      In other words, quick summary:

      * Biden was only a messenger.
      * He actually acted AGAINST Burisma’s interest
      * And what he did was 100% correct and necessary, although he shouldn’t be bragging about it because he just did what he was told.

      1. Great response, but facts go in vain to his cult. And then they trash an explanation because it’s too explanatory or intelligent for them to understand.

        The most they’ll put time into is some wacked out Breitbart or Alex Jones InfoWars bullshit, then project all of Trump’s corruption on anything they can possibly use to do so.

        Meanwhile Trump’s the one out there using his position to pay for his record breaking vacations and help his own business interests with clear corruption.

        All their messengers are corrupt, Alex Jones is out there trying to sell some crazy ass fake supplement, Hannity is out there trying to become a slum lord, Trump is out there trying to pat Turkey on the back for his Istanbul hotel and well on the way to racking up a half BILLION dollar tab for his vacations – yet idiots like Brobonk try to project that on others.

        Why deal with facts when you can live in a fact free world when you’re a waste of DNA like Trump cultists?

      2. I think most people would agree that Hunter Biden being placed on the board of Burisma and his level of compensation for same was unethical as hell. At least most people not blinded by partisanship would agree. But unethical as it may have been, it was NOT illegal. I think that the ethics of the arrangement and what that says about Joe Biden’s character is a legitimate campaign issue. But there is no reason that the arrangement needed to be investigated by Ukraine and therefore no justification for Trump pressuring Ukraine to investigate Hunter Biden.

        But here’s the thing. If all you knew about the situation was from a cursory viewing of Fox news, it would be entirely understandable for you to believe that Biden’s pressuring Ukraine to fire the prosecutor could have been about protecting his son and/or the company paying his son large amounts of money. If that was ALL Trump knew about the situation, his pressuring of Ukraine to investigate would still have been wrong because he was seeking partisan advantage. But it might have been a bit less wrong. Somebody in the White House inner circle needs sources other than fox news. I learned the truth of the Burisma issue from reading Scoopy. Scoop would you be willing to be Trump’s new Chief of Staff?

        1. I agree with everything Mr. McChesney says here. I even agree with his nomination of UncleScoopy as White House Chief of Staff. Scoop’s background in celebrity nudity would be ideal for keeping Trump distracted while others actually get things done.

        2. Could you please explain to me how Joe Biden did anything wrong in ‘allowing’ his son to take the job in Ukraine in what may have been an unethical job offer?

          Hunter Biden was an adult and a ‘free agent.’

          There has been no credible evidence presented that Joe Biden had any contract with his son on anything related to Ukraine.

          If you believe what Joe Biden was wrong to ‘allow’ his son to take the job, could you please tell me if you asked your father (or your parents) if it was okay for you to take a job as a school teacher and later as a lawyer? Asking my parents permission to take a job as an adult seems a bit odd to me.

          1. I think it’s self evident that Hunter Biden traded on his father’s position in getting that job at that pay rate. You are right in that probably says more about Hunter than Joe. But I think that as vice-president, Joe should have been aware, or at least his staff should have been aware of his son’s business dealings with foreign companies if for no other reasons than for Joe to avoid conflicts of interest. Maybe Joe was aware and told his son it was unethical for Hunter to be on Burisma’s board. Maybe Hunter decided to take the job anyway. Then again maybe Joe didn’t say anything because he didn’t care. Or maybe he was willfully blind on the subject. I think raising all this is a legitimate issue in the campaign. But it NOT a legitimate subject for Trump to use in negotiations with a foreign leader.

  3. Gossip or not, its pretty clear by responses from the GOP what their defenses are. I mean listen to what GOP herder Lindsay Graham said yesterday:

    “What I can tell you about the Trump policy toward Ukraine: It was incoherent, it depends on who you talk to, they seem to be incapable of forming a quid pro quo”

    I mean do you understand the actual DEFENSE of Trump here? It’s been boiling down to three things:

    – He’s too incompetent to actually accomplish breaking the law
    – He’s too full of shit and nuts for staffers to actually respect his ‘orders’ to break the law (Mueller defense)
    – He’s too fucking nuts to take seriously so ignore everything he actually says

    Like I mean, that’s it. Who you going to believe, your lying eyes or ears, or the GOP?

    Has a single defense from Trump, his supporters, or the GOP ever actually called a defense to his character, motivations, knowledge, or his skill – in anything?

    1. Not really. You can’t defend Trump either on the facts or on his character, so the GOP “defense” consists either of

      (1) “evil, but not impeachable”

      or

      (2) stonewalling the hearings

      or

      (3) ad hominum attacks against the people who testify. You see what they are doing now to Vindman. They want the identity of the whistleblower made public so they can start slandering him, because there is no other way to counter the complaint, which has proved to be accurate. The whistleblower could be Jesus of Nazareth himself and they would immediately start hurling obloquy.

      I understand their position. What choice to they have? The Republicans in Congress are generally educated and intelligent men and women, and they are fully aware that Trump is corrupt, because it’s 100% obvious to anyone with half a brain.

      So why do they defend him? Well a small number are just as corrupt as Trump, but for the vast majority they face a simple choice – it’s their integrity or their careers. Obviously, if they had even the slightest integrity, the Republicans in Congress would stop maligning public servants and war heroes, say “we have to get rid of this cancer on the country,” and be 100% happy with President Pence. They know that full well, but they think their own jobs are at stake, and banks do not accept mortgage payments in integrity points. The GOP back-benchers are deathly afraid of the 40% of America that thinks Trump can do no wrong.

      And they are completely right to have this fear.

      1. Funny thing about leadership: sometimes you have to do something unpopular, but right.

        Too bad the GOP doesn’t have leaders anymore.

  4. You wouldn’t know where Pence stood. Sheesh. It’s not something a normal person would wave around.

  5. Pence had a reputation before he was picked of being a party guy. Many think that’s why he was picked and that his selection was part of the deal the gop made with trump to not usurp him at the convention.

    If the party demanded he back a play to call the Cheeto batshit, I imagine he’d do it. They just aren’t going to do that at this point. Current thinking is that they might actually kick him out, have a come to Jesus moment, swear they didn’t know he was ACTUALLY crooked, and then throw some new candidate in as a better bet in 2020.

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