That was Kayleigh McEnany, drawing on her supernatural powers to give her take on Mary Trump’s new book.
I have to say that while Mary Trump “wrote” this book, she was apparently writing sections of it as the amanuensis for somebody else in the family. Mary Trump was born in 1965, so she can’t be the primary source for all these anecdotes about the president’s childhood and college years. Trump graduated from Penn in 1968, when Mary had just turned 3. The stories in the book about Trump’s youth must be the work of somebody older, presumably Maryanne Trump Barry, Trump’s sister.
One key revelation in the book: Trump cheated on his SATs. He allegedly paid a guy named Joe Shapiro to take the tests for him.
I don’t believe this story. While I consider Trump to be capable of that, and I know for a fact that some guys paid others to take SATs for them in those days, the details don’t make sense.
1. Supposedly he was already a sophomore at Fordham when he paid somebody to take SATs so he could transfer to Penn. That doesn’t ring true. Has anyone ever heard of a college sophomore re-taking the SATs in order to transfer? I’m not saying that was never done back then, but I never heard of such a thing.
2. Penn was accepting pretty much everyone then, and the Trump family had a connection with an admissions officer, so there would have been no need for Trump to have high SAT scores. He only needed a pulse and a checkbook.
3. Perhaps most important, we have to realize that the lawyer Michael Cohen was engaged by Trump in recent years to send a letter to the College Board people, threatening legal action if Trump’s SAT scores were revealed. If we assume Mary Trump’s story is true and Trump (through a surrogate) has really high SAT scores, we then have to believe that Trump, through Cohen, wanted to prevent people from finding out how smart he was. Does that sound like Donald Trump to you? We know Trump is hiding his SAT scores. It’s a good guess that he’s not hiding brilliant scores made by a whiz kid.
UPDATE:
4. Pam Shriver, widow of Joe Shapiro, says (1) it never happened, (2) and it couldn’t have, because Trump and Shapiro met AFTER Trump transferred to Penn.
Mary Trump is making a lurid claim about an event that happened about at the time of her birth, without having given any thought to all those issues I just raised. She apparently just made a credulous transcription of some family gossip, probably heard from her aunt, Trump’s sister, Maryanne Trump Barry.
——
DISCLOSURE: Trump and I were both students at Fordham’s Rose Hill campus in the calendar year 1966. I did not know him.
By the way, Kayleigh’s phrase, “A Book of Falsehoods,” is an excellent title for Trump’s autobiography.
Re: Joe Shapiro not telling his wife Pam Shriver about taking the SAT test for Trump. <<>>
In a nutshell everything not coming from Shapiro, who’s dead and Trump who’s a pathological liar is hearsay, btw, timelines are hearsay as well. As in Shapiro didn’t meet Trump until (insert time period).
Ms Trump’s book publisher not doing their own research/due diligence notwithstanding.
>
And yes, whether true or not will have absolutely no effect on the 2020 potus election regardless.
Also, and if this is a stupid question ~ so be it:
“Donald worried that his grade point average, which put him far from the top of the class, would scuttle his efforts to get accepted. To hedge his bets he enlisted Joe Shapiro, a smart kid with a reputation for being a good test taker, to take his SATs for him. That was much easier to pull off in the days before photo IDs and computerized records. Donald, who never lacked for funds, paid his buddy well.”
Does Mary Trump say Joe Shapiro, did indeed, actually take the test for Trump?
That is said to be a direct quote from her book.
Yes, I know, but parsing words she only says Trump enlisted Shapiro to take the test. She doesn’t actually say he took the test.
Sort of like Trump never said he grabbed anyone’s pussy, but if you’re a powerful, rich person “they” let you do it.
Again, until the book actually hits the bookshelves Mary Trump will wisely say nothing. But she and her publisher have got to know all the questions that will come her way on the talk show circuit/circus.
btw, was never quite familiar w/the word parsing until posting at political blogs back in the day. Digressing …
My understanding is that Mary Trump did not identify Joe Shapiro as the test taker but other parties did.
Not correct:
Thanks!
I suppose de Tocqueville has to be disqualified as an observer by your standards. “We”? Speak for yourself chump.
Sorry Bill. I’m speaking for you too. Foreign citizens don’t have a seat at the table. They can sit at the kids table and complain though. If they behave, you can give them desert. How about that?
*dessert
You’re a total moron, really.
Well, I guess. Unless Tanner is sitting in one of the 175 countries where US troops are stationed, then it might matter to him whether or not their commander-in-chief is a drooling moron.
Though I agree this book and everything in it is a pointless distraction, no matter how true it isn’t.
The day you speak for me pigs will have been flying for several weeks.
Foreign citizens don’t get to vote. They have no input. That’s the point and that’s the reality. It’s not an opinion.
You recall the saying “better to be quiet and be thought a fool rather than to speak and remove all doubt…”
The fact that anyone gives Mary Trump any credibility is absurd. Again, I’m not a trump supporter but I just can’t stand for propaganda and blind partisanship. Trump has been in litigation with Mary since 1999 when his father (her grandfather) passed away. She wanted money then and she wants money now. How old was she then? She knows absolutely nothing about anything. If she helps solidify your narrative then so be it.
Anyone who gives you any credibility is absurd, no?
Hilarious! After all your criticism of American politics and it turns out you aren’t an American. Thanks for all of your advice. We will certainly give it the attention it deserves.
You’re stupidity shines through. Apparently only Americans are fit to criticize America. So Americans, please shut up and don’t criticize China, Russia, N. Korea etc.
I mean, Mary has a financial incentive here which introduces a bargeload of potential bias, but you can factor that in. Like, I assume the contents of the book are spun and embellished but not that they came from nowhere. The book will be of interest mainly to biographers and armchair psychoanalysts.
But surely you meant to say that the fact that anyone gives Donald Trump any credibility is absurd.
Taking the opposing viewpoint why would Mary Trump, who appears to be a highly intelligent person, make up a story like this without total corroboration from all concerned, probably even Donald Trump himself?
Knowing the kind of person Fred and Donald Trump were/are sounds exactly like the kind of story everyone would joke about at family gatherings.
Repeating, it would be just plain stupid to make up this story knowing a book about the potus written by a close relative pretty much sells itself regardless.
Yielding back the balance of my time …
I think I made it clear what I think. She repeated family gossip and probably got it wrong because none of the details make sense. As written, it could not be true. First, there is the timeline problem. Nothing adds up. Second, as I noted earlier, Cohen wrote a letter to the CEEB and threatened them not to release Trump’s SATs. If you believe that Trump got somebody really smart to take his SATs for him, then you have to accept that Trump is really desperate to hide his really HIGH SAT scores. Does that sound like Trump to you?
I’m assuming the gossip is that Trump got Shapiro to take some test for him at some time, and that she got all the details wrong, because that’s how gossip works. Whether the gossip was ever true in the first place is only a matter of speculation.
On a related note 1976 joined the USN and took the 13 section ASVAB test. Drove myself to the testing center. Did well 97 percentile. Anyway went home on (2 wk) home town recruiting duty 1982 (two wks free vacation) and one of my jobs was driving recruits to the educational center where they took the ASVAB .
You guessed it ~ educationally challenged recruits were getting, hiring an intelligent substitute to take the test for them.
Anchors aweigh …
I’m well aware of the scamming done then with standardized testing, although I can’t really go into many details.
Yeah, as you get older you start to wonder how many senators, doctors, admirals and others built a career on a false foundation like this. I want to think that the pretenders, like those you describe, reached their level of incompetence and faded away, but I wonder. Do you know whether any of the cheats went on to distinguished careers, or even long careers?
The ASVAB was for enlisted, not officers. If you’re a complete idiot you probably won’t last (4) yrs, but there are always exceptions. Dexter Manley Oklahoma State notwithstanding.
With officers the military actually isn’t much different than the civilian world hierarchy ie family, political connections. There was a hot shot pilot busted for cocaine, early ’80s at NAS Oceana (Va Beach) who had high ranking family military connections that “allowed” him to stay, let alone getting his ass court-martialed. Same concept w/Epstein and the FL judge who put him on probation.
One caveat when the military changed its drug control policy @ 1981 making the punishment more severe (One and done E-7 and above) the initial testing process wasn’t very accurate. So they probably discharged many who were actually innocent the first 5 to 10 yrs. Digressing.
Bottom line you will always have serfs/peons and the warlords.
There are people in this world that for ideological reasons have decided they have to support Trump because Trump is better than a Democrat. No matter what evidence is brought forth demonstrating Trump’s execrable character, they are going to ignore it or dismiss it out of hand. There are others that absolutely HATE trump. Most, though not all, are to the left ideologically. Many Trump haters get enjoyment out of hating Trump and seek out every piece of evidence (or just plain rumor) of Trump’s failings. My point is just that Mary Trump’s book will be gleefully read by those on the left and ignored by those on the right. I doubt it will affect any votes one way or the other. But I just find the whole thing depressing. I can’t delight in my hatred of Trump because I agree with many of the things he’s done as President. But just as I start to think maybe he would be better than a Democrat he goes and says or does something awful that disabuses me of that notion. Maybe that’s why so many on the right seem to have drunk the Trump Kool Aid. While it certainly doesn’t say anything positive about their character, it is probably more comforting to them emotionally than feeling as I do. But I can’t believe something just because believing it would make me feel better. If I could I wouldn’t have spent the last 36 years as an agnostic. I just want the whole election to be over. Then I can start hoping for a Nikki Haley 2024 campaign.
OK boomer.
P.S. I’m Swiss, so I really don’t have that much of a dog in the “fight.”
So you’re . . . neutral?
Although you should be able to tell better anyone else if something is full of holes.
I’ll stop.
Are you an American citizen? If you aren’t, your opinion on American politics is irrelevant. And it’s pretty ironic for the Swiss to mock someone taking a neutral position.
Speaking as a Canadian citizen its in Canada’s best interest that our main trading partner not turn into a bigger shithole.
Furthermore some American idiocy does eventually make its way up here and stupid shit happens. The worst terrorist incident in Canadian history was committed by a Trump supporter. We don’t need more of this shit.
And you are also not an American citizen? This gets better and better. When you have American citizenship and pay American taxes you can have some input. Until then, stick to hockey, logging and maple syrup.
As a small businessman who imports products from the US I am probably already paying American taxes in some fashion. I am absolutely contributing to the well being of the American economy. As a Canadian taxpayer and citizen I pay for diplomatic relations with the US and direct lobbying of the US government.
And this Canadian is telling you to change your fucking ways before you kill yourselves. I like my job and would hate to lose it because dumbfucks like you ruined it for more sensible Americans who want to have a stable economy and a better life.
You don’t need to be an American citizen to have an opinion about the United States government or U.S. politics. I am an American citizen, but I have opinions about the governments of many countries including China, Russia, and Cuba. You do need to be an American citizen to VOTE in American elections. I believe to contribute to U.S. political candidates you need to be an American citizen or possibly a permanent resident. But if you are a Swiss citizen living in Switzerland, no sending Swiss Francs to the Trump campaign!!!
What happens in the USA is important to the world. America is a large chunk of world trade, world GDP and world pollution. America’s military exercises a major influence in countries across the world. Many Americans travel overseas and foreigners travel here in abundance.
The world is interconnected and the States are a major hub in that connection.
Some other countries may argue that what they do is their business, but the USA is not Switzerland, Liberia or Turkmenistan. America’s policies are everybody’s business. They don’t get a vote, but they can’t help but have an opinion.
And sometimes, as in the case of Russia, they can attempt to influence the voting as well. I would venture a guess that Putin’s choice for President counts a lot more than mine!
I never questioned whether they can have an opinion. I stated that they have no input, meaning they don’t get a vote in the matter. Because of that, I find their opinion irrelevant but others may not. The US is also more than a hub. It’s is the worlds only superpower. Ultimately, whether the government is kind about it or not, the US is ultimately dictating global policy. That goes for Trump or Obama. That’s what makes China dangerous. They want the influence.
I agree with this. Good post.
Nikki Haley? Tea Party/restrained Trump fan? Sorry Michael, the Party has gone down the tubes irrevocably. The faster traditional-type Republicans realize that the better.
What’s a “traditional-type republican”. Because I’m no youngster and I don’t remember any republicans who sound like you. Big government, big business, big military RINOs like The Bush family and Nixon? You certainly don’t sound like Goldwater, Buckley, or Reagan. I have more respect for the Clinton’s. At least they admit they’re liberals.
The Bushes and Nixon RINOs? Are you out of your mind? Btw, you’re spouting off at someone who got in a fight in HS for wearing a Goldwater button. The Republican Party hasn’t always been a coalition of the “religious” right, gun worshippers, science naysayers, Tea Party losers, and TV celebrity worshippers. Actually most Republicans used to sound like me until the Party started dumbing down in the 90s to become the current Party of Stupid. And I voted for every GOP Prez cand. between 72 and 12 (voted for another Republican in 16). Real liberal that.
Apparently your five or whatever it is “Ivy League degrees” and your wondrous wealth we all must envy can’t make up for a bad memory, shot logic, and shit for brains.
Like Dole and Goldwater said to each other in the 90s, people were starting to call them liberals. And they had no idea how bad it would get.
What I can’t figure out is why you constantly attack my opinions when I am a consistent libertarian conservative in the old school mold. If you are a traditional republican, then so am I. I’m not religious. I’m not a science naysayer. I’m not a tea party “loser”, and I’m not a tv celebrity worshipper. So where do you and I disagree? You seem to think we do. What I don’t understand about you is why you have this liberal painted fairytale about the conservatives in the US. We are still here. The moderate liberals are still around too. The extremist are the ones making the most noise. I’d like to believe that a vast majority of our country is sane. But to your point, I did not like Bush. Either of them. I’m also apparently younger than you as a Gen Xer. So maybe we have a different generational perspective.
So, I don’t really agree that Trump is all that different from other Republicans since the 1996 election (actually, of course, going back to when Newt Gingrich became Speaker in 1994.)
The only differences in economics between Trump and these ‘trickle down’ Republicans is over immigration and free trade.
On taxes and deregulation Trump has implemented this post 1994 Republican economic orthodoxy. He may even help achieve the ultimate dream of these ‘economic freedumb’ Republicans: the Supreme Court striking down the ‘administrative state.’
Claiming Republicans are for small businesses when Trump dropped the corporate tax rate to 20% for big business to wipe out small business competition in 2017 is hilarious. Then it’s been topped off by billions in ‘swamp money’ to his big business donors in the no interest loan program recently.
Republicans killed net neutrality so if you ever tried to compete with an ISP or its subsidiaries they could wipe you out with whatever cost they want to charge. Lindsay Graham is sponsoring some batshit anti-encryption bill to take civil liberties and protections away and expose everyone’s data to black hats.
Republicans or libertarians being the party of the small business is by far the dumbest fucking take in economic politics today. They essentially position themselves as being for the ‘mom and pop’ shop away from the evil eyes of ‘regulation’, while standing outside the property funneling money to big corporations and handing them the keys to the wrecking ball with a pat on the back.
You’re generalizing. I don’t disagree with most of what you wrote here. However the acts of a few do not represent the beliefs of the many. I am an independent because I don’t subscribe to platforms fully of any of the parties. However, unlike Bill, I don’t feel the need to be on a team.
I’m an independent as well, but when 99% of your statements are defending Trump, but then saying you’re not a Trump supporter, its bizarre.
Also saying Republicans are the lesser or two evils, when you have a libertarian party right there on the ballot to vote for, is strange. A true libertarian by nature would vote for their party rather that consider it a two party system. I’ve actually voted as many, or more, for third parties on the Presidential ballot than the Democratic side.
It comes down to who has the balls to actually but what they claim is their values into the ballot. In the end, conforming to authority is what conservatives do best. All the bitching about not necessarily agreeing with Trump doesn’t mean a damn thing come election day if you fill in the box for the bastard.
You better believe come election day if someone is a no go, I’m not just going to vote for them to be the opposite side – I’m voting for a third party.
Indy, I simply don’t understand the nonstop hatred and bashing of trumps policy. I get that a lot of people don’t like him. Hell, I don’t like him. But I can’t stand seeing everyone just bash him for no logical reason other than he’s an asshole. I voted the libertarian line most of my adulthood. My first time ever voting GOP was 2012. At the end of the day I subscribe to the statement, “if you’re not a liberal in your 20s you have no heart, if you’re not a conservative in your 30s, you have no brains”. Before you jump on me, it’s not that I believe this statement. I look at this as idealism vs realism. Idealism is for the young. At a certain point you realize you aren’t going to change the world and have to choose how to move society forward incrementally. In my opinion, Romney/ryan should have won 2012. There would not have been an Obama 2nd term. There would be no trump. And wed probably have a strong election in 2020. It is what it is. I won’t hate just to hate.
Steverino said “Indy, I simply don’t understand the nonstop hatred and bashing of trumps policy.”
The only way to do that is to close your eyes, put your fingers in your ears and go “la la la la” at the top of your lungs whenever someone tells you the truth. (You close your eyes in case they use sign language, or have made flash cards just for you.)
It’s good to know you are good with kids in cages and kissing up to people who put bounties on US soldiers. Really lets us know what a “conservative libertarian” believes in. PLEASE don’t reply. because I don’t like talking to you.
Call me a liberal and a RINO and I’m going to get more than a little nasty though I shouldn’t have gotten that nasty. By the way if I’m an independent, which I have been for several years now, what team am I on at the moment?
Trad-style conservatives (or in Rushspeak, “elitists’ or “Establishment”) have no place in the Trump cult consisting of the various groups I listed, which neither of us seems to have any use for. For better or for worse we have a system based on two parties. And we need a better second one than the Trump Party, which will be doing the dustbin of history thing by the end of this decade anyway (one man bands tend to do that). I was telling Michael that he should stop wasting his time with these people. I have no idea how in the hell the process of generating a better center/right party is going to work and I don’t think we’ll even get a clue until 24.
Re the Trumpkins: if those people are conservative, I’m the Pope (well I did used to be an altar boy). Right now conservatives have no place at anyone’s table. Even the NR has sold out.
Shit, Biden’s the closest thing we’ve had to a trad Republican candidate in at least 20 years.
On economics, the Republican Party hasn’t been a Monetarist conservative Party since Bob Dole sold out his lifelong beliefs of balanced budgets, chose Jack Kemp as his Vice Presidential nominee, and ran on his ‘tax cuts for the rich pay for themselves’ trickle down platform.
Jack Kemp himself seemed like a nice enough guy, but he was just wrong.
I agree with this. Fair points and I apologize.
By my calculation, Mary wouldn’t have even been alive when Donald would have taken the SAT. Assuming she didn’t just make this story up out of whole cloth, somebody must have told it to her. The only other family member who’s prominently mentioned (from what I’ve seen so far) is Donald’s sister, the retired judge, who seems to not hold a very high opinion of him (but is also keeping her mouth shut). So the sister would seem to be the most likely source of the story.
I agree that retaking your SATs after you’ve already been admitted to a college sounds kind of weird. Much as I’m wanting to hear more about what a heinous piece of shit Donald is, I’d like to have more corroborating evidence before I believe this one.
Here is my guess: Mary Trump has conflated a couple of events.
A guy named Joseph Byron Shapiro was Trump’s classmate at Penn, class of ’68. Shapiro was smart enough to graduate cum laude (Trump was not). There’s no evidence, to my knowledge, that Trump knew him before transferring to Penn. I’m just guessing, but I think Trump probably paid Shapiro to take some test for him at Penn, and Mary got the story second-hand or later, after the test had morphed to the SAT in the retelling.
Frankly, I’m not sure I believe it at all. If Trump had paid somebody to take his SATs or any other test, why would he admit such a thing to anyone? Certainly not because of his inability to tell a lie.
Can you imagine a Donald Trump with really good SATs telling people that they were achieved by someone else? To cite Vizzini, “inconceivable.”
Plus, as I mentioned, if he had really great SATs, he’d probably mention it every day, twice on Sunday.
To me the entire story is really flimsy.
Maybe the person who took the test for Trump told another Trump family member or Trump bragged that he had somebody take the SAT for him. After all he bragged about grabbing them by the “pussy.”
I agree it’s flimsy, but if it’s true, the only way I could see how Mary would know about it would be through Donald’s sister (or someone like that).
Or her father Fred…
That doesn’t change the fact that the details don’t make sense.
———–
I don’t think there is any possibility that the story could be true as told. It may be based on something that actually happened, with the details incorrect, or it may just be family gossip that she repeated without knowing whether it was true.
I mentioned my guess. Shapiro took some test for Trump at Penn, they laughed about it, and as the story got retold …
This like that Brett Kavanaugh stuff. I don’t care what Trump did back then. I don’t care why he is the way he is. I care about what he has during his term in office and about any crimes he has committed that are still actionable. I am concerned about who the people and entities who have given him power are, and why they have done it, and any laws they have broken in the process. This SAT stuff is just gossip, and stale gossip at that.
It paints a portrait of who the person actually is, and obviously whether it happened or not, Trump has never been the sharpest tool in the box. And Kavanaugh’s rambling hearing after the fact, about the Clinton’s and crazy shit and getting back at whoever told me more about how he’s unfit to be a judge than anyone else.
A reasonable person’s reaction to a credible accusation that may not be correct would be confusion and trying to figure out the issue. Yet he reacted like the only thing he was pissed about is his status, prestige, legacy, and power was threatened more than anything. There have been men who have been exonerated after decades of imprisonment for a crime they did not commit with much more humility and acceptance than he did.
You usually don’t have to go much further than seeing someone coming from wealth or power getting angry to know why that is and who the person really is to begin with to know that person shouldn’t be in that position. Because always, its always about money or power.
Indy, what you say is true, but we have had more than three years to get a portrait of Trump. You may be right about Kavanaugh and the usefulness of seeing him crack under pressure, but what is there to learn about Trump from events of 30 or 40 years ago? It is the Trump of now, or at least the Trump within the various statutes of limitations that is significant.
As ol’ Willie Wordsworth pointed out, “The Child is father of the Man.”
I agree its a footnote, but its also a portrait of how the ‘American Dream’ is a bullshit narrative, because Donald Trump can be as unintelligent, lazy, and incompetent as possible but because of the family he was born into and his father’s money was able to maintain status despite all else.
Figures releases today showed Harvard has a large amount of legacy or donor admissions, and 75% of them wouldn’t be admitted without that. Yet society places people in the public with wealth on some sort of pedestal, as if because someone was born into a rich family or has appropriate connections they ‘earned’ that position.
The SAT is just another narrative that’s never earned a thing in his life, and that in the end in this country, the ‘American Dream’ is nothing more than winning the DNA lottery and who you know more than anything else for the most part.
You are right, Indy. We are living in a second age of robber barons, and they call the shots in society in general and the Republican Party in particular.
I said to somebody here that we were living in a time and place where money was the measure of all things, and he agreed and said that was a good thing. A lot of people would know not to say that, but it would be what they would do anyway. Harvard is apparently an example.
Seems the Trump bio proves just the opposite: Fred Trump, millionaire, couldn’t even get his son into USC, for crying out loud, let alone Harvard or Penn.
hilton said “Seems the Trump bio proves just the opposite: Fred Trump, millionaire, couldn’t even get his son into USC, for crying out loud, let alone Harvard or Penn.”
Fred Trump was a New York City millionaire. That probably meant zippity-squat to USC, unless he was ready to pony up a BIG donation. It would have meant more close to NYC.
While the episode is revelatory, I agree with Roger that everyone’s opinions about Trump are so overdetermined by an accumulation of information that it’s hard to imagine them changing.
“Overdetermined”? I never used that word, because I don’t know what it means. If it means proven to excess, beyond not just a reasonable doubt, but beyond any rational doubt, I agree.
I agree. It’s gossip, it’s stale, and the details don’t seem credible.
Plus, consider this. If Trump had paid some very smart guy to get him close to a perfect SAT score, he would now be crowing incessantly about his high SATs and how they demonstrate his high IQ.
And that would be a valid claim. Until 1974, MENSA accepted a 1300 combined SAT as a valid admission standard. If an applicant took the SAT test from late 1974 until 1994, the MENSA society will accept him or her with a combined SAT score of 1250 or higher.
(The SAT has changed since 1994 and no longer correlates to the most common IQ tests, so MENSA does not accept post-1994 scores for admission.)
So I assume the following to be true:
* If Trump had high SAT scores, he would be bragging about them.
* He is not bragging about them, and in fact is determined to hide them.
* Therefore he does not have high SAT scores to tout.
* Therefore he did not pay a whiz kid to take his SATs for him.
Or Trump is afraid that if he brags about his SAT scores it increases the chances that he will be exposed for having paid someone to take the SAT for him…
So you think Trump was paying Michael Cohen to hide his HIGH SAT scores. (Cohen sent one of his threatening letters to the College Board people.)
I don’t think so.
“Oh, please, don’t tell anyone I got nearly perfect SAT scores. I am a humble man, and this would seem too much like bragging.”
It could have provoked release of the “fact” that he had someone take the test for him. If he had nearly perfect scores nobody would have believed it leading to the logical conclusion he had someone take the SAT for him
C’mon. You really think Trump would hide HIGH scores? You’re just grasping at straws there. He would show the world his scores, then lie like hell if anybody questioned them. He claims to be the smartest guy around, so high scores would support his claim. This is the same guy who let people think he graduated first in his class at Penn. Nobody should have believed that either, but they did for years.
Could be an embarrassingly low score followed by an utterly implausible level of improvement.
This could be true even if Trump didn’t get what he paid for and the second score is only unremarkable.
BTW – It is possible Mary Trump is misremembering and in fact Donald paid someone to take the SAT for him prior to his acceptance into Fordham.
That is also not likely. The only requirements for commuters to get accepted at Fordham were a checkbook and a pulse.
But I have to check myself. Trump would not have needed good SATs to get into Fordham as a commuter BUT – he didn’t want to go to Fordham! Fordham was his fail-safe. He wanted to go to USC and was rejected.
So to your point, it is possible that Trump paid somebody to take the SATs to get him into USC, but I doubt that, since his SATs were obviously not good enough to get him in.
I assume that if Trump had done this, he would have paid somebody exceptionally smart who would have guaranteed him near-perfect SATs. Since his USC rejection implies that didn’t happen, I’m still not buyin’ the story (without further clarification).
Umm…is there any evidence that he applied and was rejected by USC. That story could be false. I wouldn’t be so quick to discount Mary Trump’s story. At this point, it’s no less credible than the USC story.
Trump would have fit in perfectly at USC back then. That was where Don Segretti and the rest of Nixon’s rat fuckers went.
I agree. Chapin, Segretti and Ziegler went to USC.
Erlichman and my personal favorite, H.R. “Bob” Haldeman, went to UCLA.
Those are definitely Trump’s kind of guys.
He admitted that he applied.
His sister said he went to Fordham because “That’s where he got in.” It’s reasonable to infer that he was rejected by USC.
And Trump always tells the truth…given his record on lying…It’s absurd to cite his statements as evidence of any sort…except that he lies.
Here’s an interesting post from 2016. Can not speak to it’s veracity but it does make mention that Trump (or maybe someone in his name) took the SATs.
Yes, he could not have been accepted INTO Fordham without taking the SATs. I can remember that it was a requirement.
But that’s not the story in Mary Trump’s book. She claims that he “paid someone to take his SAT exam for him as he was applying to transfer to University of Pennsylvania.” That is contradicted by the very link you submitted, which says that Penn never saw his SATs. (I don’t believe that claim either, because there is no evidence to support it, and I don’t see how anyone could know that one way or the other unless the admissions officer said so, which he did not when interviewed about the topic.)
But you see my problem with the Mary Trump claim. Mary says Trump or his surrogate took (presumably re-took) the SATs when Trump was a sophomore at Fordham. That doesn’t seem believable.
Maybe this has been explained already but what about this scenario? Trump takes SAT in high school, applies USC, gets rejected, gets in Fordham with no SAT needed, then transfers to Penn which requires SAT. Instead of using previous SAT, he pays someone to take it for him. Probably someone who does it regularly and knows how to score high enough without drawing attention to exceptionally high scores. Any holes in this?
There are several holes. First, he needed no sterling SATs or anything else, to get into Penn. You’re looking at Wharton in a 2020 context. Now they accept only 7% of applicants. In those days it was more than 50% for freshmen, even higher for transfer students. Everybody got in. Moreover, Trump was interviewed by a friendly admissions officer who went to school with Trump’s brother, so there was a near-zero chance of rejection. He didn’t need to be Neil deGrasse Tyson to get in. Mike Tyson would have made it.
But the biggest hole is this: In order to believe this story, you have to believe that Trump has really good SATs and wants to keep that a secret, hence the letters from Cohen to the College Board. C’mon, be honest. Does that sound like Donald Trump to you? His determination to keep his scores a secret is just about absolute evidence that they are poor.
And finally, has anyone ever heard of a college sophomore re-taking the SATs to transfer?